An interview with Dr Fadila Grine, Senior Adviser to the Islamic Cooperation Youth Forum

An interview published by the Algerian weekly El Bassair on 23 November 2021, conducted by Amal Essaihi. Translated from the Arabic.

The Muslim woman today, in Muslim societies and in Western ones, knows that she is the nucleus of a whole society, and that on her rest its morals and its human and civilisational values. Her mission in this field is large and far-reaching: her society expects much good of her, and in giving it she offers a message of nobility, learning and character.

The intellectual and scholarly scene has been enriched by many distinguished sisters who have given what is most precious so that their luminous ideas reach the family in general and the young in particular.

This week El Bassair's guest is Dr Fadila Grine, an Algerian who has held several senior posts in several countries and whose path has led her to Istanbul as Senior Adviser to the Islamic Cooperation Youth Forum. Amal Essaihi spoke with her, and we offer our readers this engaging and instructive conversation.

To begin, would you introduce Dr Fadila Grine to us?

I was born and raised in El Eulma, in the province of Sétif. I had a happy childhood in a loving, affectionate family, and as the eldest daughter I was treated in a particular way: I was given many responsibilities from early on, and all the encouragement and support my dear parents could give. I graduated from Al-Shihab secondary school in El Eulma, where I read avidly and where I first read Uyun al-Basa'ir. Then I went to Emir Abdelkader University, where my journey into Islamic and civilisational thought began and where the lines of my character were drawn. I took a master's degree in the Department of Revealed Knowledge and Human Sciences at the International Islamic University Malaysia, where I came to see the world from a universal angle, and a doctorate from the University of Malaya, where I learned the craft of scientific research. I entered the world of publishing in international peer-reviewed journals with passion, and I also became a trainer and a family counsellor, and a trainer in several fields.

I find that my path through life and learning somewhat resembles Ibn Battuta's journey: from El Eulma, the city of my dreams, to Constantine, the city of learning and scholars, to Kuala Lumpur, where I spent nearly nine years, to several Canadian cities, where I spent most of my youth and worked in education, and then, at a very young age, held the post of cultural adviser at the Ministry of Education of the province of Alberta. I lectured at the University of Malaya and published scholarly articles in international journals, and I served as Director of Research and Executive Director of the International Centre for Training and Consultancy at the University of Malaya. From there I moved to Saudi Arabia and entered the world of international organisations, taking up the post of Director of Family and Social Affairs at the Organisation of Islamic Cooperation; I was the first woman to hold a director's post in the Organisation. I was also a member of the OIC Women's Advisory Council, which I helped to found, and of the expert council of the women's committee of the Islamic Development Bank.

I now live in Istanbul and work as Senior Adviser to the Islamic Cooperation Youth Forum, and I contribute to various international bodies: the International Union of Muslim Scholars, the board of the advisory council of the European Women's Forum, the board of "Because You Are Human" for wellbeing and mental health, the Union of NGOs of the Islamic World, the Chair of the Prophet's Biography in Saudi Arabia, and other institutions through which I try to serve society, and women, young people and the family in particular.

How did you begin as Senior Adviser to the Islamic Cooperation Youth Forum?

As I said, I began advisory work early, in Canada. But the post of Senior Adviser to the Forum came out of my previous job: youth was one of the portfolios I was responsible for at the Organisation of Islamic Cooperation, where I held the files of women, youth, the family, childhood, the elderly and people with special needs. I contributed to drafting the OIC Youth Strategy, which took shape on my desk over three years of expert meetings with the member states and the OIC's Statistical, Economic and Social Research and Training Centre. The strategy, with its implementation mechanisms, was adopted by the OIC Council of Youth Ministers in Baku in 2018. Because of my experience in this field I was invited to take on this role at the Forum: planning, guidance, training young talent, supervising the content and design of programmes, and other responsibilities.

We came to know you through social networks and through your notable part in the second international meeting on "the role of national competences in achieving economic take-off". Could you give us a sense of what it aims at?

I was truly glad to take part in that distinguished meeting, which answered a pressing need to bring together Algeria's experts wherever they are in the world, so that all their efforts flow into the country's overall national development. When I was invited to speak I already knew I would be tied up with an economic and cultural summit in Baku, Azerbaijan, which we had worked on for many months, but I could not decline the organisers from Mohamed El Bachir El Ibrahimi University of Bordj Bou Arréridj, led by Dr Achour Meklati, who had worked with me before at the University of Malaya and who I know is working to gather experts in the service of the national economic take-off, and the gifted Dr Amal Chouteri and the other cadres striving for the good of this country. In truth I considered taking part a duty. My contribution was very modest beside a large number of experts whose valuable presentations I enjoyed greatly; they agree, in principle and in substance, on a clear road map for everyone, and I hope it takes shape soon. I also felt that Algeria is in good hands as long as we are all on one page when it comes to serving the country. I decided to speak about the role of young people in launching national development.

Could you tell the reader about the idea and the aims of your talk, "Empowering youth and its role in launching national development: challenges and prospects"?

My talk centred on the importance of young people as an active demographic force for advancing sustainable development and reaching high levels of wellbeing, because at the same time they pose a great challenge if they are not drawn on as an active developmental energy, especially amid global conflicts and economic crises. The experience of the countries that succeeded in taking off and developing shows that no issue or challenge can be faced without integrating young people into decision-making and without their full solidarity, because they move and engage on their own motivation; strategically and practically, their joining in is bold and effective in the development process, according to their levels of education, awareness, integration and participation in addressing the challenges latent in every field.

I also spoke about the importance of meeting young people's needs and of studying the conditions and circumstances they live in and face. These are not momentary needs but strategic necessities and priorities for the future, directly tied to development. There is an urgent need for a comprehensive and deep scientific understanding, and for practical thinking about the scale of the potential young people represent in the context of the challenges they now face. Empowering young people at the national and global level will therefore help invest their latent or dormant potential; this applies in particular to developing countries, which hold a high concentration of young people compared with the rest of the world. Algeria's human wealth is mostly young, and that means that making good use of this demographic potential opens great strategic opportunities for research, entrepreneurship, production, industry, innovation and growth. To reach these aims there must first be a careful assessment of the state of young people and of the challenges they face nationally, and they must be given the tools of knowledge (good education) and the necessary skills, and their understanding of the issues (awareness) strengthened, and so be integrated into overall development.

I also stressed that providing opportunities for young people is not only about dealing with the difficulties and obstacles of the present. It is about scientific and educational care through early intervention: methodical, preventive, anticipatory plans and strategies that take young people in and prepare them psychologically, scientifically, culturally and socially for the roles entrusted to them in overall development. This vision is very important, and there can be no success without strategic depth among decision-makers; there is a difference between beautiful plans and strategic plans that grow out of the country's reality. In my view that depends on developing a culture of work, sacrifice, innovation and civic engagement, and on widening horizons about development, change, challenges and a culture of solutions. We are talking about solutions and opening doors, and we mean that everyone should play the roles entrusted to them so that we see results in the next twenty years. That is why I called for researchers and experts from inside and outside the country to sit at one table with the decision-makers, for a complete picture before take-off so as to avoid a fall; time is not on our side as a nation under test, facing real challenges.

Is everyone who wishes to join this conference welcome, or are there set foundations, rules and conditions?

I am not an organiser of the conference, so I do not know the criteria; my apologies for not answering this question.

Would you tell us about Baku, the capital of Azerbaijan, and about the Azerbaijan investment and cultural summit?

My part in the Azerbaijan economic and cultural summit came within the Forum's cooperation with the OIC member states to give young people's projects that have proved worthy of support a chance to take off, by providing a supportive environment made up of dozens of investors in vital development sectors. With Azerbaijan we announced the opportunity to apply; more than four hundred young entrepreneurs who met the conditions came forward, and around fifty or more were selected. A large number of investment companies interested in these young people's fields were brought in, along with a good number of investors and investment banks, and the young entrepreneurs were given the chance to present their projects. The summit was a great success: it connected creative young entrepreneurs with many investors.

On the margins of the economic summit a fine set of academic and cultural events was organised to draw investors to Azerbaijan, with its opportunities and facilities, its cultural wealth, its enchanting natural beauty and its diverse culture. We had the chance to visit the areas liberated from the Armenian occupation, and we attended the first Friday prayer in the Shusha mosque, which months before had been a pigsty under the Armenian forces. It was a journey that connected me to the past of our struggle, the November Revolution and the Aurès mountains. Through my travels in the countries of the Muslim world I have found a shared cultural spirit; some traditional songs and dress closely resemble our Algerian heritage, as if I were hearing the Chaoui chants of the revolution in Algeria's mountains and hamlets.

After a long journey of research and participation in events and international conferences, what do you aspire to in the coming period?

My continuing journey has been one of education and building experience. I have a great passion for lifelong learning, and it does not seem that I have had enough; rather I have come to believe that a person must keep learning to the last breath, especially since the revolution in science and technology has opened wide doors and ever-renewed horizons that do not close. Where experts were once expected to master one field, that has changed completely: none of us can be an expert in thought with no relation to technology, education, development, science, media and the other intertwined fields a person cannot do without. Besides, theoretical expertise is very limited and is not enough for strategic, sustained thinking; the good experiences and successful practices available around the world spare us long stretches of decline and stumbling, and scientific and international cooperation in every field opens horizons and helps meet challenges, because cooperation is the ground and the philosophy of development from an Islamic point of view, and we need to develop the systems and mechanisms of cooperation so that we serve development and progress in a practical way. I am still trying to take hold of the experience that would qualify me to write for young people, women and the family in the service of comprehensive development. I do not find the time to record the experiences I live through, and that troubles me a great deal; but may God bless us with health and years so that we do our duty.

In your view, what lies behind the domestic and social violence that has become the talk of television, print and radio? What are its causes, in Algeria in particular and the Arab world in general?

From my close following of family problems through scientific research and media coverage, Algerian society suffers from two phenomena: mistreatment within the family, and domestic violence. I say this so that we distinguish between minor and serious abuse and exposure to danger, such as physical injury, psychological degradation or sexual violation. Algerian society has passed through harsh conditions in different periods that left a heavy cultural inheritance in the treatment of women and children and in violent dealings among members of one family, to which stressful living conditions, compounded ignorance and shortcomings in education have contributed, so that the consequences of abuse and violence are almost widespread and general. But more causes can be found by examining the subtler and more complex influences.

I also follow the attempts to contain domestic violence and violence against women at the official and religious levels. There are efforts to prevent and treat domestic violence and its consequences, and many of them are promising: Algeria has strong legislation in this area, but it lacks mechanisms of implementation and follow-up. I believe scholars and imams can play an effective role in uprooting violence from minds if the spoken and written pulpits adopt this preventive plan. Until then there remains an urgent need for more systematic research to find the causes and pursue them with organised, lasting solutions, such as legislation that protects women and children, and anticipatory solutions resting on comprehensive awareness campaigns, especially in places of worship, schools and institutions. Education, literature, stories, television and radio, and above all social media, must serve a comprehensive developmental approach. Even so, violence will not stop until its causes are removed. Mental health, for instance, is neglected, although research has shown that domestic violence hides beneath unreported psychological illness that can reach murder and mutilation, and there is widespread ignorance of the consequences of psychological disorders, which puts the family at very great risk.

Do the programmes offered on our Arab satellite channels have anything to do with pushing our young people towards violence in the family and in society?

There is a real problem with the role of the media. When vision is absent, the media become a means of spreading shocking and tragic crimes, whereas what is required of a media institution is to lead in spreading awareness of the importance of protection from violence at every level, in cooperation with civil society and the authorities. The media institution also has a duty to raise awareness of the danger of early mental and psychological disorders, in coordination with mental-health specialists in schools, clinics and hospitals, so that society understands the dangers that lead to violence and plays its part in containing it and reporting abuse, until we reach a culture of non-violence. We also need a social-services system and support for families suffering poverty and stress, including in cases of mistreatment and moderate violence; we should not wait for a crime to intervene, for what counts is decisive, swift, early intervention to prevent violence. Behind many cases of domestic violence there is a destitute father, or extreme poverty and deprivation; if we caught those cases we would prevent the family's decline and the spread of violence. We lack social institutions that work together to perform this role, and I am very worried about the spread of violence through drug use and smoking and the violence practised by the abused themselves. To achieve family safety we must plan considered, anticipatory solutions in coordination among research institutions, decision-makers and the media; there are good and successful experiences in the Arab world and across the globe to learn from. Civil society must play its full part in spreading awareness to curb the media trade in domestic violence, which, sadly, some channels practise, living off view counts at the expense of the mental health of citizens and children. From this authentic platform I call on decision-makers for legislation that deters violence, the violent image and the violent story, to strengthen psychological security and plant a culture of mercy, calm, solidarity and mutual support among the members of one society, and to set every preventive standard for the protection of the family.

In your view, what is required of a woman today to keep violence from creeping into her family?

The woman is one link in a set of parties that must each have a role in reducing domestic violence: official and social institutions, the religious institution, the educational institution, the media and others are all parties to protection and prevention. Comprehensive institutional solutions are needed; patching does not rise to the level of a solution. There is an urgent need for a series of national meetings bringing together researchers, the health and mental-health institutions, decision-makers, the education institution, the Ministry of Religious Affairs, the media and social-media influencers, every party, for a comprehensive, anticipatory treatment that contains the problem of violence from every angle. That is the strategy of effective solutions, because it includes everyone and unites efforts. As for the woman, she can lead everyone with a degree of awareness in taking in her children and protecting them, performing her great role as mother, teacher or guide, to reduce the severity of domestic violence, or at least so that she is not a bridge for violence by accepting it upon herself or practising it on those around her. Sadly, many women are victims of violence and yet some of them practise it on their children or their pupils.

Would you tell us about your future projects? And what have social networks given our young people, and what have they taken from them?

In my view social media are responsible for worsening mental-health problems among the young, and this is the greatest looming danger; many scientific papers have been published on anxiety and depression as a side effect of social-media activity. If we want to talk about the positives and negatives of social media for young people, the subject is large and thorny. In general, when there is a great technical advance that radically changes the way people live, it generates debate about the nature of the change and whether it is "good" or "bad". Internet-based social tools such as Facebook and YouTube revolutionised the way humans obtain information and communicate and interact, and in a relatively short time social media had some very positive effects in empowering and connecting people; at the same time they produced new platforms for some unhealthy and even destructive behaviours. I have written on this in some opinion pieces, and I believe that knowing how to use these tools, and employing them for clear aims, protects young people from a great many pitfalls and misfortunes. Yet the danger to identity, religion, thought, behaviour and way of life is looming, and there is a mutation under way worldwide in values; without containing and guiding this development its consequences will be grave, especially in societies that do not teach the use of these tools at home and at school under the care of educators, where use is largely haphazard among children and adolescents and a large share of young people, who are exposed to a violent shock and overwhelming waves of information, images and patterns they do not even know how to handle.

Are you a reader of El Bassair, the weekly of the Association of Algerian Muslim Ulema? What do you think of it?

I began reading it in secondary school, and my memories of it are of something enjoyable, engaging and authentic. I read it less during my long years abroad, but I returned to it from time to time to drink from it as an authentic intellectual source and a meeting place of leading Algerian minds. Speaking of the weekly El Bassair, it stands in the media landscape as a free and authentic column of Islamic thought and authentic Algerian Arab culture, and it contributes to the development and growth of civilisational awareness in Algeria. It is the memory of reform and change, and its roots reach into the identity of the Algerian nation with its vital components of religion, language and a rich cultural heritage born of successive eras and civilisations. For El Bassair to keep pace with the very fast wheel of change, it must be within reach of young people and direct its efforts to them, so that they write and read and raise their contemporary issues, and it must remain the meeting place of scholars and intellectuals through time, because this paper is a trust of generations, raised from one generation to the next; the means may change, but the message is constant.

Do you have suggestions for us, so that the weekly family page rises and shines more?

I am sure El Bassair has a well-thought-out media plan. But from my modest reflections on the field of publishing and what is new in it, and without wishing to recommend what is already known, I see that the coming period has imposed challenges of a new kind that will directly govern publishing and printing. Print will certainly remain for some time. Nevertheless the digital pace is faster and more demanding, and I imagine that success will depend on digital content and will require working across several platforms.

There must be constant comparison and evaluation against good and successful experiences, and a look at our place in the world in everything we do. Take Forbes and Technology Review, very successful and well-known magazines that share their stories of success and failure with the world: both achieved great success with a highly focused digital approach, thanks to certain policies, such as having writers concentrate on considered standards and urging them to engage with readers first of all, especially the young, which is critically important for success in digital publishing, together with editors' decisions about content and interactive features. This relates to the magazine's vision, its near and distant aims, its mechanisms of implementation and reaching high rates of readers and engagement. I strongly stress continuous evaluation: it is the key to success.

Many magazine publishers have also come to rely on video as the content race intensifies; video is no longer the property of television channels after the YouTube revolution, so much of a magazine's content can become digital content on the magazine's channel, a radical change that would lift the magazine's performance to the rank of magazines with effective content. This is widely practised today. Yet simply creating a YouTube channel is not enough; one has to win approval and acceptance, because video is an entirely different medium and a completely new way of telling an event or a story or conveying an idea, and this requires a steep learning curve for editors.

Paradoxically, although social media were supposed to kill professional publishing, they became instead a main source of visits to newspaper and magazine sites. And since there is more to writing than writing, those who write content do far better than the amateurs who post it in search of likes, and the amateurs cannot do without good content. Here lies the added importance of social media, whose success depends greatly on headlines and on strong, new content that people want to share, which means sharing good writing. Digital publishing cannot do without good intellectual, cultural, religious and social content that treats society's issues and raises what matters to the reader, building a digital relationship between editor and reader; excellent publishing has always been about more than content, and more about building that particular bond.

I also think that, unfortunately, many traditional publications will disappear, because many publishers have taken one of two roads: either they try to ignore digital publishing and the use of technology and social media, which have become a reality, or they choose heavy-technology methods and try every means to game search engines and the metadata of articles and posts. Both ignore the most important element, winning the reader; the rule is that publishing is bound to readers. That, in my view, is what makes the digital opportunity enormous for better performance.

I thank you for this invitation, and I wish El Bassair success and creativity.

May God bless your efforts.